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the design industry


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#1 karl472001

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Posted 08 August 2003 - 03:48 PM

Also, please tell us what the site is about.

Waterlogged, I can make a sample way of how they should post their contests if you would like. Then you can pin it.

#2 Waterlogged

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Posted 17 August 2003 - 02:11 AM

Karl go ahead and make that form at least then we can have something to go by
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#3 Dark Tranquility

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Posted 17 August 2003 - 12:13 PM

- Coded or not and in which language :rolleyes:

#4 karl472001

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Posted 17 August 2003 - 12:15 PM

All in description. :)

#5 ruddz

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Posted 11 November 2003 - 11:50 AM

Are you all completely mad??


A person posts a "contest". They get a design and if you win get you $100 (or so)
Hate to tell ya but you should be getting a shitload more than a measly 1 or 2 hundred for a design even IF IT ISN'T USED.

Everyone who enters into one of these "competitions" is being exploited. You are worth a lot more than the "prizes" are offering. Secondly the whole idea of only one person being paid for a design is ludicrous. What are we all going to start working for free and hope that we get paid for a job if we're lucky enough?? Designing web sites is a profession. Why don't you act and charge like professionals??

You are not only demeaning yourself but bringing the industry down with you. Over the past few years we've seen designers undercut each other to gain more work. What's the end result? We are getting the same amount of work but are being paid LESS! To the point of $100 for a design for crying out loud!

The people who post these competitions and use your designs are making money off it. Think about that. A web site earns them money (indirectly). Once again, your work is making them money!! so charge them for it!!

Fine many of you are newbies and want any opportunity you can get. You're hardly going to learn anything this way! YOU ARE BEING EXPLOITED!! Go get some work experience in an established studio. Go design a site for your local charity. Go design a personal site.

If the competitions were for artworks with no commercial purpose then I would be embracing this site. But as it stands it is doing nothing but harming our industry.

#6 Fofo

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Posted 11 November 2003 - 12:27 PM

People over here aren't ready to design for professional companies.
They're just looking for a place to learn.

If your design doesn't win, who cares? If it's good I'm sure you can get it sold in the future.

People who come here don't own any big company, and thus can't afford a professional designer.
So this is a win win situation, they get a decent layout while the contestants learn a lot.

Do a search on the subject on TTF or so, it's all been discussed to death.
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#7 Waterlogged

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Posted 11 November 2003 - 02:49 PM

I do not mean any offense to any body here but every one here is a newbie at web design and this IS good experience. Not to mention it adds to their portfolio. My portfolio is a whole ONE site and no one wants to offer a newbie like me a job at a studio or something like that. Also I hate to say it but if you dont like it leave.

Waterlogged
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Adam Wilkinson

#8 marlon

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Posted 14 November 2003 - 07:58 AM

when you submit your entry, please, make sure it is an original work, we all visit templates website and the fake will be discovered sooner or later and you might get banned in this forum, even if you don't you will not win much respect stealing others' work.


And who are we to say that these big web template companies are not ripping other peoples work.

They could of stolen stuff from less noticed designers, and because of their exposure and fame , WHO DO YOU THINK PEOPLE ARE GOING TO BELIEVE IS THE ORIGINAL DESIGNER.

Have you heard of stories, of original programmers getting sued for their own work.

And how are you going to prove this? Source files means nothing...It can be replicated and then you will have two different source files. And then you would have to prove originality between the two source files. mmm.....

People have ripped stuff off me and I can't do a damn thing about it . (Just change few things on the design and it becomes their).

Copyright.....mmm is there such a thing?

I have seen things my friends.

I believe places like this can be good learning for newbie designers, but it also can hurt this industry in the long run.

You say this is not a site for professionals but for learners, cool, but when you do go pro, are you going to be working for $15 a Logo. Have a look a reverse auction sites and see what these pro's get paid.

I know just starting out, you need to build up your portfolio, thats cool, but don't lower yourself.

As reverse auctioning sites grow, the pockets of designers shrink. Companies will always take the cheap way out. Competition between designers are being exploited.
And companies are now turning to reverse auctioning sites to get their cheapest qoutes on jobs.

We should speak out loud and make a noise on the net about these reverse auctioning sites, which do nothing (Referel fee ? my ass) but exploit and degrade our industry and get paid for it.

Contests are good, but I think the prize money should be more. Its starts here. If a company wants to pay peanuts to hire a designer or buy a winning design......for the first time. Their expectation for furture projects when hiring designers are paying them..... (you guest it) peanuts !!!

The administration of this site should have a better minimum prize money marker of say $300 - $400 for logo contest and so on for other sectors.

Reverse auction sites should also follow as better minimum markers, but no one can bid under the marker. The company will simply choose the best portfolio or the best person they think that can do the job when the marker is reached. This will ensure that the pockets of designers will not shrink, buy setting these markers.

I might start a site like this.

Well thats my 50c . I hope I have'nt offened anybody.


Cheers

Marlon

#9 Fofo

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Posted 14 November 2003 - 10:16 AM

with all respect, the logo designs over here are not worth 400$
Why can't you just cram it in your head THAT WERE NOT PROFESSIONALS, and we don't expect to get paid as professionals, neither does the host expect a very professional outcome.

They get what they pay for, if they offer 300$+ they're sure to get something very nice and close to the work of a professional, just look over at yaxay. If they can only offer 30$ well then they're probably not expecting something awesome but they can't pay more so they're happy they can still get a decent design/logo for that price.

These design contests do not influence the industry at all, imho.


I do agree that there should be high standards in the professional industry. But in the end companies who are serious about their work will choose quality above price, no?
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#10 miao

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Posted 14 November 2003 - 11:28 AM

I'm Italian and I don't know how is the situation in the US or in another country. However I believe that in this site layouts and logos are not worth 400$ or more.
They are not professional.

The work for a Logo is not made by the simple creation, making. There is a study behind. For a professional logo you have to know all about the factory or company. A logo is not just a symbol, is the company itself. The first thing that people see.
The logo of Nike is really simple, but anybody know it.
You can pay up to 10000$ or more for a professional logo. You pay the study.

Here you can be paid only for the realization and maybe an original idea.

If you think that the price is too low you can decide of refusing the offer.

I don't believe that this site could influence the industrial market. People that can spend only few dollars or euros for a website or logo do not ask it to a professionist, in any case.
There are other places were you can buy or take for free a nice layout. Here you can make a layout for fun, to see the work of other people and to learn from them. (And, if you are lucky, to pay the connection to internet :p)

#11 TheAdept

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Posted 30 November 2003 - 02:47 PM

The question of whether or not these type of contests end up exploiting the designers involved and degrading the industry in general is a tough one in my opinion. I agree wholeheartedly that a good design/logo is worth far more than $100, but it is also true that many of the designs posted here are not worth even that.

Personally, I would like to see a heftier payout for the contests, but I can also see the point of view of the person posting the contest. I would hate to post a contest with a prize of $400-$500 and then get only substandard entries. I'm not sure what the best solution would be. Perhaps the people hosting the contests could say they would be willing to pay $XXX amount for a great logo, $XXX amount for a decent logo, and $XXX amount for a mediocre one. There would be a certain amount of honesty and fairness required by all parties, but it would allow for some of the uncertainty involved in not knowing the skill level of those who will be entering and possibly make for a more equitable payment system.
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#12 DDD

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Posted 12 December 2003 - 04:57 PM

First off. not to toot my own horn but I am neither a n00b nor un-professional. I am knee deep in the graphic design field and have been for a while. I am here for 3 reasons:

1. Because I think this is a good idea.

2. This is valuable practice for me.

3. Fortify my portfolio.

I will admit I have seen some sub-standard entries and it is for this reason this site has not fully blossomed. But as more designers come and the young guys get better so will the traffic and the monies offered. Personally I have done logos for 50 bucks on up to $2,000. so there is a broad spectrum. Is this bad for the industry well yes and no. I dont think me nor 2A will go out of business from this kind of stuff. So stick around and contribute this thing will grow. And you can make a few bucks in the process.

#13 phacker

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Posted 15 December 2003 - 01:28 AM

Everything, everyone said is all well and good. But what if you win, send the source files. The contest holder screws with the source files, and wants to know what is wrong, but won't reply to posts. I resubmitted files three times, and no response and no money. Be a long time before I turn over my source files again.

My only consolation is he doesn't know how to use my files.
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#14 simplistik

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Posted 15 December 2003 - 02:11 AM

Heh, that would be why you get your money first b4 you turn over the source files. And if you really wanted you could have them sign a contract/release form.

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#15 phacker

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Posted 19 December 2003 - 07:49 PM

For the kind of money being offered here, it's not worth the effort (contract, etc.). I'd just like to think it was being used. But haven't seen that either. Don't like that kind of music, but worked with it. Would just like some feedback from the contest holder. I don't know what version of the program he is using or why he felt compelled to compile a new version. He could have just used the existing swf.
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